How important is "speaking faith"?

facedown

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El Curiouso

How important is "speaking faith"?

« on: January 10, 2010, 04:43:43 PM »

I wonder what are the orthodox interpretations of these 2 verses which all charismatics use to prove that whatever you say you will get. If you say you're a loser then you will be a loser and so on.
I don't know if this is true. What if a person says that she is a loser and has a negative self-image simply because she has lost many times? Then she did not become a loser because she said she is a loser.
But every charismatic will simply say that this person is only a loser cause she says she is one. Roll Eyes

Could these verses really be saying that whatever you say will become a reality? But this sounds totally new-age, like this whole Oprah crap. Huh?

I really cannot imagine that this is what the bible means but then what do those verses mean?

Let's say nobody likes me and since nobody likes me I think that nobody likes me then this thinking is not the cause but only a result of nobody liking me. If I now started to think that everybody likes me then people still wouldn't like me, right?

Pro 18:21 Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

Pro 23:7 For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart is not with thee.


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Charles H. Spurgeon: "The craving to alter the Word of God is accursed. This is the crime of the present day. The Lord preserve us from it."

David

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Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2010, 08:54:07 PM »

Have you ever thought about how badly you could destroy a person's self worth simply by the things you say to them? Just like saying uplifting things helps a person. The things you say about yourself gives those around you a gimps of what's in your heart. Attitude, the proper attitude, will take you far in either direction.

If we see ourselves as deserving of punishment and thankful for salvation purchased for us because we are valuable to the creator of the universe we are a bunch closer to having the right attidue over someone who thinks they are an accident, only entitled to handouts from the government.

David


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Winter

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Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2010, 11:22:16 PM »

Face, if a Christian and a New Ager both believe the world is round, which one is wrong?

Just trying to make a point.

And our words are powerful, they can tear down or build like David said.


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roadrunner

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Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2010, 02:06:30 AM »

I believe that how a person thinks in their heart will eventually find it's way out, it will express itself one way or another. We can unconsciously manipulate our own environment to produce a result we already have in our minds...if we think we are a loser, we will unconsciously promote that image to the world, and therefore, we can produce that result. It can be a self-fulfilling cycle. However, where I think people go wrong with the whole idea is to think, I can be rich, etc. to produce a specific result. In other words, I think a psychological projection can be self-fulfilling, but where skill, knowledge or experience are involved, we can't just talk it into existence.

I agree, our words are powerful, not just in how they affect others, but also in how they affect ourselves.


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facedown

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El Curiouso

Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2010, 09:48:58 AM »

I agree with you that words can be destructive. This is clear.

But what I was actually getting at is this metaphysical stuff. Do you believe that those verses also mean that your words and your thinking affect your reality?
For example most successful people or athletes usually also have a strong will and think positive and some of them simply seem to "think big" and always have this vision of them being successful. This of course sounds pretty new agey. But could those verses also mean something like this, that a person which thinks she is a loser will always be a loser simply because of her thoughts? And if this person started thinking differently then suddenly everything would change?


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David

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Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2010, 01:13:50 PM »

Quote from: facedown on January 13, 2010, 09:48:58 AM

Don't confuse faith with attitude and self image.

Here's a verse that can help improve your self image: Psalm 42:11 "Why art thou cast down, O my soul? and why art thou disquieted within me? hope thou in God: for I shall yet praise him, who is the health of my countenance, and my God."

Now the day God lead us to that verse, He punctuated that with one of the largest blessings we received in a while.

The size of your faith doesn't matter...its that you have faith at all. But you cannot trust in your faith, you must trust in God...that is faith. Some wonder about the world wondering if by doing this or that if it will show more or less faith in God. That is the wrong attitude...you must follow God regardless. I think we need to spend much more time on our knees and asking for direction than giving God options and then choosing which one we think He'll bless.

If we are to go to a foreign land and minister there and see thousands saved and hundreds of churches planted and be remembered for eons, that's one direction that God gave to one person He trusted to do that work. Perhaps there is a person of lowly stature that had faith, prayed, but only lead one person to Christ. That may have been the one direction that God gave that one person to follow and they did. So what?

Now what if I told you that the second person is the one who lead us to Christ. Does that change anything?

David


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facedown

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El Curiouso

Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2010, 05:50:33 PM »

Quote

The size of your faith doesn't matter...its that you have faith at all. But you cannot trust in your faith, you must trust in God...that is faith.

But the faith you have is always directed at something. I mean what do you do if you are in a situation where you need help from God but at the same time you don't have faith that God can or will do it?
What comfort is left when you don't have what is needed in order for God to do something? If God only moves if faith is present then what does the person do which knows that he has no faith?


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David

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Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2010, 09:41:08 PM »

Quote from: facedown on January 13, 2010, 05:50:33 PM

But the faith you have is always directed at something.

Perhaps in faith you place in people and things, but faith in God always directed at Him.

Quote

I mean what do you do if you are in a situation where you need help from God but at the same time you don't have faith that God can or will do it? What comfort is left when you don't have what is needed in order for God to do something? If God only moves if faith is present then what does the person do which knows that he has no faith?

Then you must ask God to help you with your faith. Sometimes He'll give you a kick in the pants to wake you up.

It is an act of your will to trust and not trust. If you walk around saying that God probably won't answer your prayer you need to get the focus off of your sorry ass and back on Him because God is the source. He is all that matters. He means what He says. He'll do what He says. Likewise we need to do as we say and if we claim to be followers of Christ, then back it up with action. God sent His only Son to die on a cross. Jesus laid His life down for the sins of the whole world. There are people going to hell that never believed and then there are those who believe and are going to heaven. Now, you DO have more faith than those who are bound for hell. You do believe that your sins are erased. So trust that the same God who loved you enough to provide the way back to Him is quite capable of taking care of business even in your life. Make that decision today!

David


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facedown

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El Curiouso

Re: How important is "speaking faith"?

« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2010, 09:21:22 AM »

Quote

If you walk around saying that God probably won't answer your prayer you need to get the focus off of your sorry ass and back on Him because God is the source. He is all that matters. He means what He says. He'll do what He says.

Bold words.

But do you follow them? What do you do with things like these? Do you believe in them as truth or do you somehow rationalize them?
I'm not trying to attack you, I'm just saying that today christians rationalize everything and nullify the word this way. They always have excuses and explanations which a promise in the bible doesn't apply them them anymore.

Psa 103:2 Bless the LORD, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:
Psa 103:3 Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;

Pro 4:20 My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings.
Pro 4:21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart.
Pro 4:22 For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.

1Pe 2:24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Mat 8:16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:
Mat 8:17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.

For example when you ask about wether Isaiah 53:5 includes physical sickness and physical healing then most christians will say that it is only about emotional healing even thought Matthew 8:16-17 makes absolutely clear that it is referring to physical healing which Jesus produced through his suffering. I really don't understand how pastors can simply keep teaching their people false stuff.