Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

facedown

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El Curiouso

Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« on: January 20, 2010, 09:11:22 AM »

Hello. I debated with another christian about this. He believes that God is involved in it.He said that nothing like this can happen unless God allows it. Thing don't just happen.
And then he asked me wether I really believe that God had to helplessly watch what was happening and could not prevent it.
This is definitely a tricky question.
I don't really know what to think about this. I heard that in Haiti the majority of the population practices voodoo and that voodoo
is even an official religion there. Could this be the reason why this happened to them?
Does this mean it was either God's direct judgement or God simply had to allow this happen and could not protect them because
of their wickedness?


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The fast, the furious, the incredible, the incomparable Face "El Curiouso" Down

Charles H. Spurgeon: "The craving to alter the Word of God is accursed. This is the crime of the present day. The Lord preserve us from it."

David

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Posts: 1556

Re: Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2010, 11:35:28 AM »

It is exactly correct that God allowed it. Now the important question is why. All we can do is speculate. Only after the benefit time might we be able to answer this question this side of heaven. I believe that Haiti had already suffered greatly for their national sin. Just look the vast differences between the eastern and western halves of Hispaniola. Haiti doesn't even resemble The Dominican Republic, its neighbor to the east. You can nearly see the border without the aid of a dotted line.

The earthquake could have happened even if Haiti were a "Christian" nation. :Natural: disaster occure. Not that God is helplessly watching from the side lines. He set up the conditions to allow the earth to grow and for the continents to move. People just need to rely on God and not luck!

But I have a differenttake to why it happened. It came when I was listening to Derek's recent interview with Paradox Brown. What if Satan caused it to happen? With God's permission!

It would satisfy several points of his agenda. 1. Mislead people from God and 2. Then kill them. A third point might be to try to raise a ground swell of opposition to God...especially if we have blow hards saying that God caused it.

Think about it.

David


« Last Edit: January 20, 2010, 11:39:57 AM by David »	Logged

roadrunner

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Posts: 1796

Re: Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2010, 04:06:04 PM »

http://www.chomsky.info/articles/20040309.htm

Quote

Haitian historian Patrick Bellegarde-Smith writes, accurately describing the terror in the slave state next door, which was not relieved even when Haiti 's successful liberation struggle, at enormous cost, opened the way to the expansion to the West by compelling Napoleon to accept the Louisiana Purchase . The US continued to do what it could to strangle Haiti, even supporting France's insistence that Haiti pay a huge indemnity for the crime of liberating itself, a burden it has never escaped - and France, of course, dismisses with elegant disdain Haiti's request, recently under Aristide, that it at least repay the indemnity, forgetting the responsibilities that a civilized society would accept.

The threat of democracy in Haiti in 1991 was even more ominous because of the favorable reaction of the international financial institutions (World Bank, IADB) to Aristide's programs, which awakened traditional concerns over the "virus" effect of successful independent development. These are familiar themes in international affairs: American independence aroused similar concerns among European leaders. The dangers are commonly perceived to be particularly grave in a country like Haiti , which had been ravaged by France and then reduced to utter misery by a century of US intervention. If even people in such dire circumstances can take their fate into their own hands, who knows what might happen elsewhere as the "contagion spreads."

The Bush I administration reacted to the disaster of democracy by shifting aid from the democratically elected government to what are called "democratic forces": the wealthy elites and the business sectors, who, along with the murderers and torturers of the military and paramilitaries, had been lauded by the current incumbents in Washington, in their Reaganite phase, for their progress in "democratic development," justifying lavish new aid.

When Aristide was overthrown by the 1991 military coup, the Organization of American States declared an embargo. Bush I announced that the US would violate it by exempting US firms. He was thus "fine tuning" the embargo for the benefit of the suffering population, the New York Times reported. Clinton authorized even more extreme violations of the embargo: US trade with the junta and its wealthy supporters sharply increased.

A 1995 USAID report explained that the "export-driven trade and investment policy" that Washington imposed will "relentlessly squeeze the domestic rice farmer," who will be forced to turn to agroexport, with incidental benefits to US agribusiness and investors. Despite their extreme poverty, Haitian rice farmers are quite efficient, but cannot possibly compete with US agribusiness, even if it did not receive 40% of its profits from government subsidies, sharply increased under the Reaganites who are again in power, still producing enlightened rhetoric about the miracles of the market. We now read that Haiti cannot feed itself, another sign of a "failed state."

The punishment of Haiti became much more severe under Bush II -- there are differences within the narrow spectrum of cruelty and greed. Aid was cut and international institutions were pressured to do likewise, under pretexts too outlandish to merit discussion. They are extensively reviewed in Paul Farmer's Uses of Haiti, and in some current press commentary, notably by Jeffrey Sachs (Financial Times) and Tracy Kidder (New York Times).

Putting details aside, what has happened since is eerily similar to the overthrow of Haiti 's first democratic government in 1991. The Aristide government, once again, was undermined by US planners, who understood, under Clinton , that the threat of democracy can be overcome if economic sovereignty is eliminated, and presumably also understood that economic development will also be a faint hope under such conditions, one of the best-confirmed lessons of economic history. Bush II planners are even more dedicated to undermining democracy and independence, and despised Aristide and the popular organizations that swept him to power with perhaps even more passion than their predecessors. The forces that reconquered the country are mostly inheritors of the US-installed army and paramilitary terrorists.

But the right way for the US and France to proceed is very clear. They should begin with payment of enormous reparations to Haiti ( France is perhaps even more hypocritical and disgraceful in this regard than the US ).


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roadrunner

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Posts: 1796

Re: Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2010, 04:32:31 PM »

Considering the US and other Western powers' role in Haiti over the last century, one has to consider the possibility that this last disaster came from the hands of those very people who have a history of attempting to enslave that country. And considering that the US is the one with HAARP, which has the power to do such things, the finger may be pointed directly at us as the offenders. Russia also has the capability to do these things, but she doesn't have the history of involvement that the US has, a history of tamping down their freedoms and keeping them enslaved. Perhaps we should be looking at our own involvement rather than attributing these disasters to Satan or to God.

Then, too, we have to consider that this could just be a natural occurance. After all, and earthquake in that very area has been predicted for years, and with devastating effects.

Quote

An international earthquake expert at Oregon State University predicted one week ago that one of the world’s most at-risk locations for a major, destructive earthquake is the fault that runs through Haiti and near Port-au-Prince.

That prediction, made during an interview with a reporter for Scientific American, was by geologist Robert Yeats, a professor emeritus at Oregon State University, who said the death toll would be tremendous “if they have an earthquake on this fault that runs through Port-au-Prince” – an observation that is now playing out in the aftermath of the hugely destructive earthquake Tuesday that appears to have killed tens of thousands of people.


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David

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Re: Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2010, 11:25:22 PM »

What happened in Europe and Japan after WW2? Wasn't the infrastructure rebuilt to modern standards for the day? What a boon to Haiti if they too benefit with such improvements that the quality of life there also improved for them? This tragedy could turn into one of the biggest blessings Haiti has ever experienced!

My wife suggested that scenario.

David


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Winter

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Re: Was the Haiti earthquake God's judgement?

« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2010, 01:15:32 PM »

One could say that the mess Amerika is in today is a Judgment of God.

Or it could just be a case of crap happens.

God does allow things to happen, but I do not believe he always causes things happen.

It was unfortunate that the buildings there were substandard. But with an earthquake so close to the surface, less than 7 miles, the damage still would have been massive.

Want to add, because some in the church at that time (the infamous 2oo yr pack with the devil) taught that blacks had no souls or even worse, belonged to the devil many felt rejected and turned away form God and turned to the one they heard they belonged too.